The use of skill checks...

Innuvindyl · Post by **Innuvindyl** » Sun Nov 30, 2003 3:07 pm

To bring up a more contructive topic... 
 
I was searching for the topic about unlocking the camera, when I stumbled onto a topic about DM rolling dices etc... 
and it made me think about making personel skill checks, I've seen some players do it, though I never use them myself. 
 
Now the situation is that I play a bard... who likes to juggle a bit here and there, sometimes just plain and simple juggling, othertimes more complicated juggling, and I can see the reason to make a skill check on the more complicated parts, though I go more along the linies of deciding for myself whether or not to fail, since sometimes a failure would ruin the overall RP, when the permance is more a background to describe the scene... 
 
What I would like to bring up here, is peoples view on skill checks (also from the DMs), and a discussion around how to estimate the DC and which skills to give bonus. 
 
(for instance, I want to perform an extraordinary advanced juggle, juggling is somewhat tied to the dexterity, but I would claim that ranks in perform should have influence on the check as well (it is afterall a perform'ance) though the perform skill is tied to ones charisma. And how do I determine the DC for this advanced piece of juggling, to a normal person it should be quite high, but as I have practised my juggling for quite some time now, could I lover it to, lets say, a fifty-fifty chance of success... etc... the questions are many!) 
 
Please put in you voice...

Thurgrin Axebender · Post by **Thurgrin Axebender** » Sun Nov 30, 2003 3:27 pm

I use skill checks a lot and have other players make dice rolls as well. I know the DMs ask for die rolls alot as well. 
 
I base my DC on a scale of 1-20, much easier to figure out a 50% chance of success (DC10). I start at DC10 and scale the difficulty up from there depending on what the roll is for. 
For instance, asking someone to make a Lore check to see if they recognise a Dwarven coat of arms would be at least DC15 unless it's an obscure clan then it'd might be higher. The system automatically factors in the Lore skill modifier. 
 
Some checks such as stat rolls do not factor in your modifier so you have to add it in yourself. 
 
One memorable moment in using a stat roll was when Vald slowly regained his memory and realized he'd been taken advantage of, made to become a mercenary or something like that. He wanted to attack the opportunistic dwarf that held his contract and Thurgrin restrained him. Using an opposed Strength check to see if Thurgrin was successful in grabbing him and then later knocking him down and sitting on him. 
 
Most times, if you send the player a tell asking for a die roll and tell them what it's for, they're willing to follow through with it. Also by doing so, I feel it adds another element of the pen-n-paper experience to a computer game. <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)"> 
 
Besides, it just ain't D&D without rolling dice!

<hr /> 
 
Dwarf: Tak natu yenet 
Common: 'til next we meet 
 
~ Thurgrin Axebender 
Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub188.ezboard.com/bthevast.showUserPublicProfile?gid=thurgrinaxebender>Thurgrin Axebender</A> at: 11/30/03 11:30 am

Innuvindyl · Post by **Innuvindyl** » Sun Nov 30, 2003 3:37 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>The system automatically factors in the Lore skill modifier.<hr></blockquote> 
 
Is there a special feature for making skill checks ??

goatte · Post by **goatte** » Sun Nov 30, 2003 4:12 pm

Use your 'dice bag.' You can make the rolls public or private. You can roll against abilities and skills, too. Great tool. I've used it with Ashby to try and restrain him. I'm not as good as Thurgrin with it, but I try. It was a blast watching him and Vald rolling the dice for the difficulty checks. 
 
goatte

Innuvindyl · Post by **Innuvindyl** » Mon Dec 01, 2003 2:49 pm

Thanks alot for the comments, I guess you'll see me rolling dice like hell in the comming sessions...

bmm0321 · Post by **bmm0321** » Mon Dec 01, 2003 9:49 pm

By all means use them, they are useful in RP situations; and even in some dungeon situations (listening at a door for instance). I use them whenever it makes sense to use them. (Old D&D habits are hard to break.) 
 
bmm 
<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/pimp.gif ALT=":hat">

Post by **Algernon's Ghost** » Tue Dec 02, 2003 7:00 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr> how to estimate the DC and which skills to give bonus.<hr></blockquote> 
 
If you are rolling against another character's results, you can just say the highest result wins. An example of this would be two bards rolling perform or dexterity checks (or a combination of them - judge style and skill separately?) to see who juggled better. 
 
Alternately, since the dice bag shows your specific skill bonus with the roll - making it public, if you feel it is warranted for the situation, you could say whoever has the highest bonus in a particular skill wins. Another example would be arm wrestling by comparing strength checks - in this case, if one character had a strength of 18, and another had a strength of 12, you might want to only compare bonuses since it is very unlikely the weaker would have a chance. (But then again, arm wrestling is not just strength, there is skill involved; so if both parties involved agree on the rules, go with them). 
 
Choosing a DC is more difficult, and could be open to interpretation from the person making the roll. I am sure there are situations where not every player agrees on the DC, so it will be up to all parties to discuss that. 
 
When a DM asks for a roll, he or she will always see the result on his screen no matter where they are in the world. You will get a tell stating whether or not you learned something because of your roll. If a DM does not ask for a roll on a quest, and you are making them anyway, do not automatically expect to get a result from the DM.

<hr />They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security. 
-Benjamin Franklin

Innuvindyl · Post by **Innuvindyl** » Mon Dec 29, 2003 3:11 am

Another question... If I would like to do bluffs and persuade checks on fellow players... what should I suggest as their opposed roll ??

ish07 · Post by **ish07** » Mon Dec 29, 2003 3:20 am

Perhaps a Wisdom check?

Innuvindyl · Post by **Innuvindyl** » Mon Dec 29, 2003 3:22 am

so they would roll a dice and add wis/int mod and I will add persuade, bluff or something along the charismatic lines... ??

ish07 · Post by **ish07** » Mon Dec 29, 2003 3:28 am

Actually, in the dice bag, you can do straight ability checks, so just have them select wisdom, and you do whichever check you're doing, be it bluff, persuade, intimidate, whatever. 
They should all be available in the dice bag unless the Hordes skills haven't be added to it, I'm not sure.

Post by **Algernon's Ghost** » Mon Dec 29, 2003 10:33 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>Another question... If I would like to do bluffs and persuade checks on fellow players... what should I suggest as their opposed roll ??<hr></blockquote> 
 
The problem with doing ablility checks against skill checks is that the modifiers are much higher with skill checks, and most skill checks will beat ability checks every time. I would recommend doing opposed player to player checks within the same category of checks (skill/ability/saves) most of the time, but it is still up to the players involved when doing player vs. player rolls. 
 
Also, where persaude checks are concerned, don't feel like you have to do something that would totally go against your character's beliefs just because another character succeeded in "persuading" your character. Persuade is not mind control, and should be limited as such.

<hr />They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security. 
-Benjamin Franklin

Innuvindyl · Post by **Innuvindyl** » Mon Dec 29, 2003 11:01 pm

Yes yes I know... 
 
for instance I tried to steal from a player today, and it failed. Then I tried to persuade him into thinking I had just accidentally stepped on him... (having prepared the scene etc., by pulling water from the well just next to him etc., so I would seem believable that I just had stepped on him instead)... I then made a Persuade check, but I couldn't really use it for anything, as there is no sense motive (or what it is, it is called in PnP) skill to oppose it... so what should be used instead ?? 
 
Gratefully we settled the matter on good judgement of the skill check, so this time it went fine!

Post by **Algernon's Ghost** » Mon Dec 29, 2003 11:17 pm

You could always oppose eachother with the same skill checks, in this case both making persuade checks. You'd at least both be on level ground there.

<hr />They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security. 
-Benjamin Franklin

ish07 · Post by **ish07** » Tue Dec 30, 2003 3:37 am

Valastrius thinks that Innu shouldn't steal...unless it's for that whip<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/wink.gif ALT=";)"> , then he might even lend a hand <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/happy.gif ALT=":D"> 
Surely he has some spells that might further the cause...<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif ALT=":lol">

Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub188.ezboard.com/bthevast.showUserPublicProfile?gid=ish07@thevast>ish07</A> at: 12/29/03 11:39 pm

The Vast

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